0:01
Welcome to the negotiators, week three, can you believe we’re almost This is halfway through, we’ve got two more weeks after this. And then well, you might not have reached the stage of being master negotiators. But you’ll have a lot of the content of what, what it takes. Because then it really does. implementation is the biggest challenge for all of us. And I think we experienced a little bit of that last week in the empathy circles, right? With just even just the very simple pieces of being able to reflectively Listen, to paraphrase what another person has said, even mirror what they said, label some of what they said is not as simple as it may seem. So, again, today, I hope we’ll do a little bit of time, or at least what I’m going to invite is somebody if if somebody wants to be in a hot seat, or we can do some kind of an exercise today again, so that we can just, you know, start to feel that but as we’ve gone, you know we’ve we’ve gone through I’m I’m going to just share my screen again.

1:30
And this is just more this is this is where we are so strengthening our court this week, this week, you know, we’ve looked at the mindset, we’ve gone over the 10s, we identified last week, the 10 skills, I’m still going to be emphasizing some fundamental ones, because I want you to be able to start really using them. And but this week, to strengthen that part of strengthening out core strengthening the emotional side of our capacity. And sometimes part of that is just sitting and biting your tongue. Does anybody ever bitten your tongue? Yes. And if that’s what it takes, you know, to build, but it’s like, it’s like anything, we’re building muscles, here, we’re building the capacity to sometimes sit silently. Sometimes it’s only for two or three seconds. But even that creates a way for people to step in, to say something that they weren’t going to say that gives us greater insight into what’s going on below their surface. That gives us more information so that then we can make a more informed next step in our discussions with them. So I am just showing the slide again. But again, week one we went over emotions are essential in decision making that negotiation is to some extent, it’s it’s the science and the art of emotional framing. And so that’s why we’re emphasizing understanding, digging up under, you know, the underlying emotions. Last week, we went into the 10 skills, and we have tested out our capacity for that in our empathy circles. And then I asked you to flex some of those muscles this week. And so we we looked at all of those 10 skills. So I’m just skipping through this because this was just last week. And this is just a reminder, we will what we went through, and the 10 skills, being to be able to evoke a mindset that is not the aggressive, hard, bold kind of a concept of what negotiation is about. It’s not just co opting others into our way and getting them to do our bidding. But it begins with the process of a deeper understanding and digging into what is below the surface so that we do under stand, what we often just hear at the surface and part of the ways then we do that, with that kind of a mindset of where we’re going how first we’re looking at what is going on inside our counterpart. Sometimes in order to take that, to have that capacity, we have to quiet ourselves. And so focusing on things like reflecting and mirroring, focusing on identifying and labeling gives us a chance to calm our own inner emotions, by focusing out on our counterpart. By having the courage sometimes is what it takes, and tongue biting capacity to allow silence to be part of the negotiation process. It’s the part of the exploratory part, having the capacity to paraphrase another and not just input your own thoughts about what they’re saying, but paraphrasing what they have said, being able to tell their story, and having the emotional fortitude to know that because you’re able to tell their story, it doesn’t mean you have to agree with it. But it’s important to be able to know it, and to be able to retell it

6:31
so that they can know you have heard them. Most of us know how desperately sometimes we want to be heard by another. And a really good place to start is by having the courage and the strength to hear the other first. You know, the good old covey seek to understand before seek to be to be understood. I’m so having that capacity, to be quiet, to paraphrase, to be able to tell this story from their point of view. You don’t have to sell out your soul and and and buy into and simplifies IE, you know, take on their story as your own, but empathize. And so show the understanding, then, as we get on into further into the negotiation process, and I’m going to introduce later on today more about these guiding questions, we introduced the concept of them. And even we talked about I statements last week, and the encourages are pretty easy, but they’re still important in this whole thing. And we went over the kinds of Yes, and we’ll keep cycling back around to really look at these, to dig deeper into them. To put them together in slightly different ways. These are kind of like the ingredients. I mean, when you go into the kitchen, oftentimes dinner is made of chicken or some kind of meat and you have some kind of vegetable and you have some kind of carbohydrates. But you make 1000 different kinds of recipes based on having all of those elements in slightly different combinations. So what we’re doing, we have these core, this core set of skills, but we can put them together. And even just as individuals, we will put things together differently and uniquely. And in each situation, it will be different and unique. But part of it is as we move on through, we’ll be coming more aware of these skills as being essential in the overall work of building empathy, which is trust and rapport. So that you can then introduce your objectives, what you want, and any kind of, you know, to create the foundation upon which you are able to influence the other’s thinking and eventually work together to come up with a solution and an outcome that works for both parties. I mean, part of the reason why we enter into negotiation is this usually something that’s not quite fitting together well in the first place, and even that can be minor or it can be major. So We will keep coming back to these. So this week, we’re going to start and look at, I call them the five C’s. But I’ve kind of changed around this, you can look at them as five C’s is the preparation. But I will go into more detail about the preparatory piece, which is, it’s it really is this pot down here. We noted it, as we looked at the, as we looked at the stages last week. But we’ll dig into that more this week into the details of that. And I’ve prepared a

10:39
and I have prepared a sheet for that, which it might be a little bit early to give it to you.

10:51
From the point of view, as we haven’t gone through all of the elements. On the other hand, there’s no reason not to have it. And just to know that we don’t, I don’t want it to confuse your to sing like it’s too complicated. But we will go through the preparation of that. We’ll look at maybe too many maps today. And I’ll explain what they are and our labs or our practice session. Now, first of all, before I go too much further, I do want to mention that this week, I’d really appreciate it if everybody would schedule, about a 45 minutes slot for a one on one call this week with me. And you can do that. I’ll put this in the chat box. And you can do that, you know, even while we’re sitting here you can set that are that is for feedback. And also so that I can answer any questions to you one on one about what we’re going over. If you’ve got anything that you want to ask me specifically. So we can use it both both ways that time. So I will allow 45 minutes to an hour if you’ve got questions for me. Otherwise, as part of this, I really am looking forward to some feedback thus far. Because already I’m starting to line up people for the this program that I’ll be giving again, in October will be starting in the early parts of October. So I definitely will be looking for your feedback. And I know that you want to finish the course. And I’ll probably ask you to have a survey at the end of it, as well. But I definitely wanted to start by getting some real life feedback from what you’ve had thus far. So if we could plan on doing that this week, I’d like to get that done this week. So I’d like to now come back to this week’s homework, your practicing of your mirrors and your labels. I guess my first question would be is, did you start to see more opportunities to use them? Or are you still not really sure. I mean, after a while you start to see, oh, I could have used a mirror there. Oh, this is a great place for me to respond by it seems that you’re more or It sounds like you. And then to notice the feedback that you get to if you can sense the different trajectory that the conversation takes as you do that. I’d like to get feedback on your homework and in that way. So open, open up the mic and go for it.

13:53
Well, I’ve done nothing. I’ll be honest. Thank you, Beverly. We are on our fifth lockdown. We’re not allowed to go out on the land. I have visitors were allowed to go shopping. can’t visit the family. Nothing. And this was our first time. I’ve had a couple of phone calls for friends just catching up just to have someone to talk to. And

14:20
that’s it. That’s frustrating. So as you as you’re going through the checkout, are you able to ask them? Oh, I do. Wonderful.

14:32
Yeah. Tiny shops. They have been subdivisions. You know, you’ve got a picture on this chicken shop on the little supermarket. I checked them.

14:45
Yeah. So look for a place in those discussions where you can say, you know, they say you might say, How are you and they say, Oh, this darn lockdown. And you could say darn lockdown pause and see what what comes next

15:11
is I agree with them. Because the husband and wife and their three sons we run that we’re all on the same wavelength about lock bounds on. You know, all the other stuff. So we’re agreeing and talking about different information we’ve got we share it. So yeah, I think I’d do it automatically.

15:35
So and in agreeing, might there might there be some opportunity to discover something that is different about their thinking? Or their feelings? Or where that comes from? Or perhaps just the curiosity of, of hearing their story about how how that reminds, because I recall speaking to a friend of mine who originally came from Iran, and the minute the last minute the masks were off, people were being asked to wear masks. What for her that became, it made her think about the restrictions she hurt, she realized she was triggered by that. Yeah, the restrictions of her leaving Iran under the circumstances she did, etc, etc. So I’m just saying here is, it’s still an opportunity to discover something that you don’t know, even if you agree with what their comment is, take it as an opportunity to discover something that you don’t know about that person.

16:59
Or what I think I do, so all that math degree. Because I’m a people person. And you did, I definitely said to my grandson, I live on my own. Women have 45,000 words, I have to speak every day. There’s no one I can talk to in lockdown. So you’re going to get me to chattering away like crazy. And he just laughed my head off. So when I go in there, I have started to build a rapport with the young Oh, they’re in their 20s and their mother and we’ve got like a friendship going. So I’m always extending out and asking things and finding out how they feel. And that so I think I do it so automatic, that I don’t realize I’m doing.

17:43
Okay, very good. So yeah, the main, the main point here, probably, that I would like to encourage is is an attitude of curiosity about those that you engage. So fantastic, Beverly. Anyone who was going to step up out of the limelight goes into your go, Cynthia. I’ll go I’ll go. And

18:27
it has, you know, without getting into specifics, I’ve had lots of opportunity to practice. And and it’s interesting how in my mind when I’m thinking about what we’ve learned, and the conversation as as I’m like, just then the silence and the reminder of like, they might share something more than I need to know about and remarkably, they do much as the like validation of like, I hear you. Mm hmm. And then set is like they’ll fill the space and then I have more information and like this is pretty fun. Really interesting. I talk a lot I interrupt people so it’s been like really good for me to take that that’s different way of editor it not learning so much about the people close to me. I’m like wow, this is great. And then that helped me formulate questions to get closer to you know, did did I hear you say this correctly? And what is it that that you need from me or what is it that you are lacking we could put in looking for Yeah, to like work through like, let’s get To a resolution, let’s get to a solution. And wow, it like it was it resolved, like a big problem in a shorter amount of time. So,

20:11
anyway, fantastic to hear. And, yeah, I was really happy to hear that you said it made it fun. Because so many people think of negotiating, and it can be, it can be very hard. But to find the fun in listening differently, and drawing out through simple skills to realize how powerful that can be. That that’s, I’m thrilled to hear that from you, Cynthia, fantastic. Thank you. Definitely, too. For me, it was,

20:58
I find, I stumble into things a whole lot more than approach them strategically. And, and so I had one one discussion where I went into it with with someone that that I know pretty well. And I found him doing the mirroring on me. And, and he was doing all the things that we had talked about. And it was really interesting to be on the other end watching it watching it happen. I think my experience was more than me actually taking control and doing it, it was really watching someone else do it to me. And how I felt when he was really trying to get me to clarify like, you know, I hear you saying blah, blah, blah. But it was really, it was interesting, and it kind of encouraged me to kind of, you know, really, really take this more seriously and employ it more, I think I didn’t do a very good job of using it all week. But uh, but that really helped it kind of really showed me that this is this is something that really can have impact and be powerful. And I think connecting what you just said, Patrick, with something that Cynthia was saying is that, that sometimes in these moments, when we utilize these skills, when we actually have these tools in a way. We’re what we’re helping people do is clarify things themselves. This person was clarifying for you. And you found that helpful. Yeah, yeah. So I suspect that what Cynthia also was doing for the what the folks she was interacting with, it was clarifying for them, and people feel grateful for that. So that’s part of the kind of the the, you could call it healing or the transformative, or whichever way you want to say that it’s, it shows that the relationship is progressing. It’s not just a reiteration of things that have been said before. But there’s progress and development. It’s transformative engagement. Yeah. be out there. Yeah, I think like, like Beverly said to, I tend to, I tend to go on automatic pilot, you know, it’s kind of like an auto how I deal with people. And it’s very different to is what it is doing is enabling something deeper, and enabling something, like a more and more significant to come out. And so that’s why I really, I really want to take that that next step to really kind of being able to allow something to go beyond what’s on auto for me, it’s just like, I’m really comfortable in this space. But, but actually, there’s something deeper there. And I think these these kind of tools would really allow more of that to happen, if that makes sense.

24:01
Right. And the interesting thing is, as we do, practice, and see how it works with others, we’re actually learning about ourselves more. So it’s so again, one of the the aspects of emotional intelligence, as it’s, it’s called, is self awareness. And so this is also a process of deepening our own, building our own self awareness. Because when that awareness is there, then we have the capacity to utilize our strengths, and put things in place to to strengthen our weaknesses. Because there there are things about us that are just unique to us. We’re not going to change ourselves. But there are things that we can do to augment or to strengthen those pieces of us that are uniquely us. And maybe not as strong as they might be for the, for the work that we need to do. So having that self awareness is such a critical piece. So yeah, it sounds like that’s part of your journey, Patrick. Yeah.

25:21
And, as for me, I find it really hard to get into the habit of identifying and labeling I. Yeah, unless, like you’re into the zone. But something happened last week, and that, I think, the, the psychology, I guess, the heart of being a negotiator, and this class has really helped me kind of practice. I didn’t, I didn’t think I applied everything. But there was one part that I think I applied. Um, it was like a very sensitive situation. And it didn’t, it was not a conversation conversation on negotiation, it was more and written communication. And it was equally even more stressful than than verbal. But I’m glad that it was in written communication, because I had time to digest. But during the last three weeks, this classes that we had, I think it helped me put things in perspective. And so without understanding the point of view of that person really had to go into the core of what they want, and what’s their motivation, because it helped me digested. So it took me about four hours to respond to her communication, it was like, a very important decision, that would imply if the whole the organization, but what I did is really to go deep down into the core of why she’s doing this, and what does she want? And what’s her motivation? Because without going there, I don’t think I could come up with the three points that I asked her. First, this, there was something that she wanted, and she said you could not do this. And then but, you know, I knew that I had to compromise otherwise, it would be the most devastating, damaging effect. So I said, Okay, those two No problem, I can give that I can, we can adjust and we can do that. But the this one last point, can I mention? I will, I mentioned three points, so that she would understand my point of view. But in order for me to say those three points, I had to research into her what she wants her motivation. And I started with, I understand, I am your motivation. And this is what you want. And, and so and then I listed those three. And at the end, I said, I don’t think it’s demeaning to do this. I mean, I personally think that if we do this, it’s demeaning, and it’s, it will generate negative. And then, but you know, to my surprise, she responded very positively with just three sentences. Okay, you can go ahead and you can have it, let’s do let’s go your way. And, um, but it took me four hours, like you really delve into the heart and make effort to understand her. And I think, you know, to me, I felt like, I can negotiate.

28:58
Yeah. So that sounds to me morally, like maybe you don’t feel confident about you know, some of the bits and pieces but you got the heart of the idea. And as you build your skills around that, you can become a greater negotiator. So I mean, that’s, that’s, I think your your experience with what I heard you say was, to your surprise. Yeah, I was pleasantly surprised. I will happen. Yeah, that will happen. Time and again, when people feel heard or understood more than what they were expecting.

29:54
Man, we’re, we’re just all of us. We’re just human. Got a brain? Okay, we got three brains. My version, we got three brains. But you know.

30:07
But still, essentially, we’re just we’re all very much that very much the same and there are core needs that we have. And when we genuinely respect that, and the other person no matter who they are, up, down, left, right, the best the worst of the world when we respect that in the other, they can surprise us. They will surprise us because our view of them as one way, but it’s not all of who they are. So of course, they’re going to surprise us. Yeah. And looking for it is is giving them a chance is wonderful. Yeah.

30:51
Yeah, the element of surprise is really it’s, it’s, it’s a crowning, it’s like a crowning glory, because this person is known. She has this reputation of being very difficult person to deal with. And if you don’t have a good attack you. But yeah, thank you. I think it really helps. I really feel bad.

31:15
Help. Oh, antastic. That makes me feel good. I like feeling good. Grace, or Camilo. Any comments, I know, you didn’t have much of a chance to even get to know what your homework was. So my apologies for that. But yeah,

31:43
no, but you’re known now that I’m thinking about the because most of the time, we tend to say, No, there was no opportunity to put that into application that I spent one week off. So I was traveling, so I wasn’t working. So I wasn’t theoretically in a situation in which I would need to negotiate. But now that I’m thinking during the first, the first I took the plane last Friday, and on Saturday morning, I had to pick up a car on our rental car rental. And I was the first in line. And then I went out to eat something that I was the first in line, someone came in second, then I went out to eat something. And when I came back, the other person had taken my place. But I said, I don’t want to mess with anyone. So it’s no. Anyway, when the seller will come, I’ll I’ll be the first The problem is that the seller came and they talked to the other person. And I was completely unable, as I was imagining myself saying, I’m going to say that I arrived first. But the other guy will say that I went out that I lost my place. And I already started imagining a whole mess. And once again, I didn’t want any trouble. So once again, I sacrificed my position. And now with some distance I say everything I could I mean, I could have started by saying I came in first. And maybe the other guy would have said, okay, and that was the end of it. But I was already imagining a conflict. And even if he had said, Oh, you went out? I could have say what do you what do you just said? Oh, so you’re telling me that you came in second. But now you want to be the first as simple as that. And I will I guess the guy would have felt easier. But the problem is that I was already mad. Yes. So let’s not do that. Now. Let’s leave it, leave it like it is. And the problem is that it’s been one almost a week and I’m still thinking of our dough, I left myself I let the other guy go cut in the line.

33:57
And I am going to be giving you what I call a mini map which was a little bit stimulated by merrilees this point last week that I never quite got around to in the in the class last week. But I’ll give you a very simple little formula that can guide you through instances such as that. So that then you’ll have a little bit more in your hands as to what what to say. So that you can help resolve those types of situations and not still be living back there. I guess that story reminds me of the what was the the two monks who were walking along the road and that in the down the mountainside and I came across a stream and there was a beautiful, clearly, you know, a rich woman who who was standing at the side of the river and she wanted to get to the other side. Well, monks take these particular ones, but taken vows not to even touch a woman level on you know Pick them up and carry them lock stock and barrel across the river and put them the other side. But that’s what he did. And so then both of the monks then walked along and continue to further down the road. And then this monk who had carried the the woman across the stream could see that his, his friend was still was worried about something. He said, Brother, what’s what’s what’s wrong? He said, How could you do that? You you’ve had, you’ve had a vow not to even touch a woman. And, and he returned to his friend, he said, Brother, I picked her up, took her across the river and dropped her at the other side, you’re still carrying her.

36:00
So we need to be able to complete something and leave it there. So that we we don’t carry these things on for too many, too long. Because that’s, that’s part of who we are, as human beings we do when we, when we’re, whenever there’s a conflict of sorts, where in that were torn by two values, we have to have a way to resolve that and deal with that. And so a lot of that is what we’re dealing with, when we’re dealing with negotiations, even we have to resolve our own, our own divided CNRS are in a division that’s going on. So that’s part of what we’ll be dealing with here. And part of why it’s important for us to become to develop that emotional intelligence, so that emotional fitness, and to strengthen our, our core at in terms of our emotional capacities, so and again, merely, you know, whatever little pieces that wasn’t a matter of doing it perfectly, we’re not going to do it. You know, we’re not quite Olympic athletes, we’re constantly learning, we’re sustaining, building and sustaining our core. And even if we were that, that Olympic athlete this week, that are struggling about everything going on in Japan, but chances are that in a month’s time or two months time, if they don’t keep exercising, they’re going to lose their muscle tone. And so, you know, this is this is who we are, our emotional fitness is an ongoing work. And we’re constantly learning. So the journey that you’ve made, even this week is fantastic. Not and the same for Cynthia and, and Patrick and Beverly recognized. But she’s she already doesn’t end there. There may be more to to Beverly, and then maybe more to others. So I think that’s the key thing is not to see that it’s one and done, or were bright, or were terrible. But to see it as a journey and a strengthening and, you know, a level of fitness. That to look at it that way rather than do have it or don’t you know, don’t you have it. So they’re just some key key pieces. So now I want to jump in to, to look at or just actually a very quick reminder, I’m going to get got too many things open on my me go. So one of the things I wanted to remind you is that you know, this this constant, you know, that we’re learning and that we’re learning how to use new skills, or we’re learning to use things that we’ve probably even done to some extent before but in a slightly new ways. And to do it more intentionally. And so just to remember that learning feels awkward. If we don’t, when you’re learning a new language, even just hearing yourself, try to speak another language can just feel so horrible, you want to stop doing it. But I encourage you to embrace the awkward Think about it for a moment you’re creating these neural povs have not been set up in your brain yet. That’s what learning is we’re setting up new neural pathways that have never been there before in our brains. So when when we’re doing that, where we’re building new connections, building new connections, just playing feels awkward. And it takes time. Eventually, we’ll get to the place where we’ve got these new neural network networks. And then you fire them at one end. And they just usually all the way through to the other end, we know what we’re doing. And you’ve probably heard people say that when you’re wired together, they fire together, and maybe you’ll get to that mastery, but it takes time. And somebody is put the number 67. I don’t know why 67 it probably sounds better than 66. but less than 68. Anyway, this is something like 67 repetitions of something before you begin to really feel comfortable with it. So. So the question would be would be there is how many times did you practice mirroring or labels last week, which

40:55
is a walk up to 67 yet. So if you’re not just just embrace the awkward, it’s okay. struggle with it, wrestle with it, that’s okay. Just don’t shy away from it. And do you make the effort. And that’s what’s that’s what will really work for you. So there’s just that little reminder. And so now what I want you to do, is I’m using this at the moment, and I’m testing it out to see how this if this is helpful to you, as a learning tool for understanding. Now, I’m calling these little, you know, the kind of like little recipes, as I’m calling the minimax, because they’re kind of like a little journey that we need to go. So the default one for at the simplest level that I do want you to keep using is to mirror, repeat the last one to five spoken words, that the other person said, to have a smooth voice, you can use a nice smooth voice, because, you know, your tone of voice can calm things down. And he probably needs to be calmed down if the emotion if the situation is intense, but especially if the emotion is intense. I don’t know, I’m going to just invent this Camilo. But you know, that person might have said, and we’ll get to some other bit juicy stuff in a minute, but we’ll start here. And might, they might have said no, I’m first in line, you could have said first in line,

42:51
and then have have that silence and let him fill that space. He could have been aggressive and said absolutely. Yes. You. You know, I mean, there are people like that. And then and then you decide whether this is how you want to, you know, you spend your, your emotional currencies or not. And then you can just let it go. Or, or maybe they’ll say, Well, yeah, I thought you I thought you left. So but here we go. I mean, they could have been so many ways that that person could have responded that to do that would just set up a slightly different outcome, potentially different outcome. All of these, we don’t guarantee the other person’s response. Nobody guarantees another, you know, another person’s response. But this provides the opportunity, it creates the space, it creates the right kind of emotional framing. For something different to happen than what you’re assuming. You can follow up your mirrors with a label. Oh, it seems like it seems like you’re in a rush. You could say yes, my wife’s you know, she, she’s just gone into labor. And then you’d go Whoa, whoa, whoa, Okay, go ahead. Go ahead. Um, you don’t know, I mean, who knows? or, or, or he could still just be insistently, you know, aggressive and whatever else we don’t know. And then you make your decision based on on that. But the point there is that it gives you more information for you to decide how to proceed. When you have more information from the other about their circumstances, then you can make a better under make make a better decision about how you want to proceed. And what is important to you in this moment. And if It was critical that you get that car and get out of there, then that gave would give you the opportunity to simply respond and say, Yes, and I, but I’ve got this situation. And anyway, so the point there is mirror, and or label, and then pause. without explaining, just refrain from the urge to comment about, about what they about what you just said, or justify or sold anything in that instance, give the moment, give them in that moment, a chance to give you something more than more information than you currently have. All you knew is he was in front of you. And you don’t know why that’s really hard. That kind of a cold read, is really hard to completely understand what’s going on and why. And or to give him a chance to step aside or not. Now, what’s important here in this particular instance, is that you could have, let me see if I yeah, you could have made a label first, and then a mirror, you don’t have to do just one or the other. But I do want you to get very comfortable with using the label in the mirror. And silence, or mirror and label and silence, just to practice it to build your confidence in what it can do to cultivate you, as a curiosity seeker as a discoverer as a member of Star Trek or as a detective, or is what again, whatever concept you identify with, you know, whether you’re, you know, a galactic in sport Explorer, or whether you’re, whether you’re a detective or a scientist, or whatever. But curiosity, and be curious about the other and to use these to discover more is is very critical. Now, the piece in the little mini map that I want to add this week. So that’s basically kind of your default, mirror label and silence or label mirror and silence using those. Then, the other piece that I want want to introduce this week, and we’ll go into more depth as we dive into the preparatory stuff in a minute, or in a little while.

47:50
And this is you probably in this is more of a laundry list concept is more of a tactic. So one of the things that’s going on here in in, in this dynamic is that when we label emotions, and especially negative emotions, the interesting thing about labeling negative emotions is that it tends to defuse their power. When we label positive one, it tends to underscore and emphasize them and encourage more of that. This is a really important thing to remember, because this is kind of like the human element one on one that’s really on your side. So one of the things to do, when you know you’re about to come into or the more you’ve prepared your laundry lists, the more you do this, the more you’ll have a number of them on the top of mind. And so it’s it’s one of those things that gets easier. But it’s also one of those things that as you get into more higher end, or high stakes negotiations, that it’s important to really think about them and to put the time into thinking and preparing. And so we’ll do that with the one pager that I’ll give you in a little bit. But here the point is the their laundry list of all of the things that that person might say about you. You don’t care. I mean, even just thinking back to last week, merely when you said your son, you know made lots of you know, he had a strong you had at this interaction, we’d have to go back into that again, the details of that to get some of the specifics, so forgive me if I’m not if I’m not remembering your story exactly accurately. But you know, some as a mom, you know, It’s fairly normal for a kid to say that you’re a terrible mom. Anybody ever heard that one before, or a terrible dad for that matter, or, you know, a terrible friend, or whatever it might be. So, but to take the time to think of all the accusations, all the complaints that they could have, you never listen, you don’t care, you’re not fair. You’re horrible. You always say that. I’m sure you have a laundry list for some of your most important relationships. And even you know, when you get to the workplace, it’s important to stop and think, what could that person think about me? In Camille’s case, that you could you could you could think maybe that person would think, Oh, yeah, you know, this person’s a jerk. He just thinks he can get out of line and come back into line, I’ve put all my time into staying here in the line and thinks he thinks he can go and get his food and come back and think like he’s in, you know, and still in line? I don’t think so. He’s a jerk. You know, the point is think, I don’t know what that I have no idea what that other person but you can go into the other person’s mind and think about, or you don’t have to agree with them. And even if you think of the most outrageous things that they could be saying about you, completely untrue. But what they still might be saying about you, does anybody ever said anything untrue about you? Probably, what are the chances that somebody is going to think something that’s untrue about you? probably pretty good. If you

52:07
can think of that thing. That isn’t true. That they think about you. And then you can say it, I bet you think that I’m a jerk.

52:28
You’ve taken the sting out you’ve you’ve deflated their balloon, they can’t come back at you with that one.

52:41
With any power, or or it’s just not going to work.

52:48
I know, you think I’m a jerk. I know you think I don’t care that I’m unfair. But I’m the worst mother on the face of the earth. I bet you think that I do this just to annoy you. Because I don’t think you’re smart. Whatever, you know, think of a laundry list of those things. And say that.

53:22
Sorry, sorry to interrupt. If I got it, right. You’re saying we prepare this list? In we, we alter it? And we alter it? Yes. Before the other person has stated before the other person said anything. Another another.

53:39
Another instance could have been you could have walked up to the person in the in the airport, it’s up to the person at the ticket desk at the airport. And you said Look, I bet you think I’m just another one of these selfish patrons of your airline that just wanted to get something for themselves. But I’m going to be horrible. And ask you if you can give me an upgrade.

54:12
The point is you, you set their expectations. You give them a moment for it to sink in. You set their expectations low. You think I’m a jerk. You think I’m the worst person. You think whatever that other person is thinking about you. You could have said perhaps to that person. I know you’re going to think like I’m a jerk. But you know, but from what I could see, I was I was the first one in line by saying that, I think I think you might be thinking that I’m a jerk. You take some of the sting out. He doesn’t he won’t come back to you as hard. The point is, I want you to test This out this week, you know, in some situation with an inadequate laundry list, they might come up with other things and call you other things. And then you realize, oops, I didn’t get I didn’t complete my laundry list. But you know, or you know, Murli with with your son, the next time you’re about to it, have a difficult conversation. Look at look, I think you need to do homework, don’t just stop, I think you need to be homework. Start with I know, you know, I suspect that you think that I’m really unfair about your homework, that I really don’t take you, you know, you know, your summon the conversations that you had before. Start with that? And see what it does. See how the conversation then continues? And don’t forget to then, you know, you follow up with? It seems like you, it seems like you, you think you’ve got a handle on all of your homework. But do you have you do have it done? Do you have the plan? You know, you can follow up with whatever conversation it is, but again, use these things, then then maybe then he might respond? Yeah, and I’ve got a plan. And I’ve got, I’ve got a whole two hours to get it done. And so I’m having some fun now. And then having fun now. When he might, I don’t know what he might say? Well, I was until you came along, or, or Yeah, now you reminded me, I’d still got my homework to do anyway, you can, you can, it’ll just open up the conversation in a very different way. So this one, especially, you know, when you’re entering into a difficult conversation, and not just deepening, finding out information, but one of the things that you can do is to introduce your laundry list, and to quote unquote, inoculate them with with some of those, those thoughts get ahead of what they’re thinking show that you’re thinking, from their point of view. Because prior to that, it was just you know, to two heads, two different people knocking, but all of a sudden, I guess a lot of this reminds me that has anybody ever studied Aikido? Nobody, okay, one of the things I really loved about Aikido was that it was all about using the other person’s energy. If they were the aggressor, you would use their energy against them. But you do that by stepping alongside them, and then redirecting that energy. And that’s kind of what’s going on in this process. by stepping alongside and seeing the world from their point of view, you’re taking a position alongside them. And then it’s at that point of view, you can, if they’re very angry, you have a chance, then to redirect that energy in a new direction, towards your objective. Because this is about reaching certain goals, that you have Merlis goals, in your conversation in your email was to, you know, protect the organization, make sure that people that that that I’m assuming some many times this is a common thing, many times managers or leaders in businesses, they have this strong sense that, you know,

59:03
they get offended if they’re not if their directions are not followed. And they tend to think that whatever it is that they say is the best thing, whereas those who were at the implementation level often have insights as to how best to implement, but they don’t have. So negotiating up to the point where you’re helping them understand that actually your goal, if that’s what you really want to achieve, it’s going to be better to do it this way. You’re redirecting that same energy, but in a slight in a in a better direction. And so your goals and objectives aren’t necessarily dramatically different, but your process was, and so your negotiation in that situation was to change how to get there. Because from what you could see, I understand is, in fact, you figured that that particular process being recommended wouldn’t have achieved the desired outcomes. But you wanted to you You weren’t finding the desired outcomes as much as you were trying to say that’s just not going to do it right. Many negotiations will be about process and, and sequencing about how to do things to get things to a better place. Oftentimes, we don’t have dramatically different inputs. But sometimes heading in the wrong direction will put you on the rocks instead of take you around the breakwater. So again, here and just for a moment, and then I’ll questions this, this defusing strong emotions, the laundry list is really good at that you can still you’re mirroring gives them gives people a chance to see themselves, to see their own emotions.

1:01:06
To to

1:01:09
I mean, even just the the idea of an actual physical mirror. It’s not like we don’t know. Okay, I’ve got a shirt on, I’ve got a jacket on, I do have my jeans on, I’m not in my PJs. I know where I am. But still, I like to look in the mirror and see what the other person is seeing. By providing other people mirrors, we’re giving them that we’re providing them that service. It’s a kindness and labeling, that helps take them deeper into understanding even their own feelings and emotions, which sometimes we we really do need to work with somebody to explore and better understand our own emotions. And this is one quote that I that I had that I found that I liked. And interestingly, Dr. Elton Mayo was in Australia, and I didn’t know when I liked the quote, but he just happened to be an Aussie. One friend, one person who is truly understanding, who takes the trouble to listen to us as we can, as we consider our problem can change our whole outlook on the world. When we think about how we go through our days, how many encounters with other people? Do we feel that they understood us? Or were we talking so loud, because we’ve, we felt that we wanted somebody to desperately hear us. So we thought that talking at them would do the best job when you help. And maybe that was the best job, we knew how but now you’re no more. Now we know this whole thing of empathy and the first part of negotiation to to create the environment within which people can experience empathy. So that then we can move on to the next stage of the negotiation, which is kind of like in the keto, you turn the energy around, then you can start to put in your own objectives, your own voice, your own recommendations. And done well then you’ve got two people thinking on the implementation process of that, and not just your own thoughts, or your own team’s thoughts. Because this, this process can be expanded to teams so that you’ve got a team working together in a negotiation with another team. And that’s another stage of developing negotiation and negotiation capacities, etc. But this whole process can be taken to that level as well. So questions about about what we went over thoughts, reflections, any anything just

1:04:34
I have a question. And then thinking about what you’re sharing, I have an interview for a grant or like grant Ben’s 45 minute interview and obviously they’re looking for something on their side and I’m looking for something on my side. So are interviews like also an opportunity to to negotiate like that I do have some I have some power in that. Like, I can actually Yes, I mean, then yeah, cuz you’re like, oh, like me like me like me, but really, like, is this a good fit? What is it that how does this one like I can? Ah,

1:05:13
I mean you? Yes. Because in any interview, whether it be a job interview or a grant interview, too many times the person going into being interviewed, kind of just sits meekly and feels like they’re they’re the one gaining everything, rather than seeing that there and it’s your job to interview them from a different position. But as much as it is theirs to interview you because you might not want to work with them. They, sometimes we don’t know what we’re getting into when we, you know, develop a partnership, and a grant, and a grantee, grantor and grantee is a partnership. So it’s important actually to understand what are they really looking for? What are their expectations, and, and so this I’m glad I’m giving you the one pager then this week, I was a little concerned that it might be a little too confusing or whatever. But I Anyway, I’ll throw it out there. And then you can look at it. Even if you use just little bits and pieces of it and don’t use it all perfectly. That’s okay. That’s okay. I just want to stress that here in all of this, just start to, even if all you can do is mirrors and labels, label some of what you know, it seems like to the to your grant you the person saying it seems when you when you hear when you’re getting to the point where there, they might at least a bare minimum and you can possibly have done it beforehand. But that that’s a judgment call. And I don’t know the exact format or anything. But usually they’ll say Do you have any questions. And that would be a place where you come back and say, Well, it seems that I don’t know what to say next in this particular instance, because I don’t know what your most important things are, but that the one page will help you should help you identify what is most important to you. So in all of this, in any negotiation, one of the first things that we do need to do is to clarify our own goals, to understand what it is that we consider the most important.

1:07:41
Otherwise, you know, they’re not going to know what’s important to you. Or it’s important to you.

1:07:48
And to have it framed. Now one of you you’ll see in a lot of negotiating classes, they’ll refer to the BATNA bat in a big ignore it. So bottom line, it’s kind of like your bottom line, coming up with your bottom line, I would just urge you not not to worry about your bottom line, because already you’re negotiating yourself down. One of the things I want you to notice, in your own thinking is that as you think about what it is that you want, you’ll start you’ll start having a you’ll start negotiating with your with yourself, Well, I want to have this goal here. But maybe that’s too high a goal. Maybe I shouldn’t do that. And besides they want try to put that don’t negotiate yourself down before you’ve given them a chance. You don’t there are some situations where people go in for an interview that go in for a job interview. And then you know, they somebody says so what what kind of a you know a salary you’re thinking about, somebody will say something they could have made and and the people hiring, we’re thinking of something twice what the person said. Why do I say that? I’m saying that mostly just to say is sometimes we do not have all the information. So the key thing about an interview, and negotiation is it’s an opportunity to uncover more than what you already know. So that you can make a more informed decision about your next steps. critical, critical critical, the whole whole point of a negotiation really, is to uncover However, additional information so that you can get to a place where you can make a better collaborative effort towards a solution. And what all of these questions are and the mirroring and the labels, well, that you know, the the laundry list is to defuse the negative emotion so that you can get to the next step. And so a lot of this is all about dealing with allowing people to vent if that’s what they’ve got to do defusing where you can underscoring the positive side helping people feel better, because we’re actually, interestingly enough, we’re actually smarter our brains function better when we’re in a positive state of mind.

1:10:55
Our brains function more optimally, when we’re in a positive state of mind. So if you want to make a bad decision, go and get grumpy. Go get stressed out, go get mad, go get indignant. Alternatively, there’s value in having a positive frame of mind. So okay, let’s Why don’t we have any other questions? Sorry, I, I almost use that as a jumping point into the next part, I get too excited sometimes. Sorry. If you have the Christians on what we’ve had so far, and then I will get into the, the the one page of the preparatory stuff and give you a you know, a tool that really helps you organize your thoughts and see start to see this in, you know, in a bigger pattern to

1:11:59
any other questions. Or you just want to jump into, okay. I don’t know whether you’re that excited, really. But anyway.

1:12:11
Okay, so where are we? Here we are, we’re on this page. Now, today get to so we’ve gone over that. So here we are, we’re at our preparation, I said preparation for the storm, it’s important to understand that that that can be part of what’s going on in this and we do need to be prepared. It’s not uncommon for us for a lot to be going on below the surface. It’s not just, you know, the duck that’s looked or the swan on the surface that looks very elegant, and just moving slowly through the water. But underneath is pedaling like crazy. Sometimes what’s going on underneath is boiling. We know we’ve sat on so many things for so long, where we’re like a ticking time bomb. And that’s probably no more obvious than in situations where, you know, there are and I’ll refer because some of the some of the fun stuff that I have learned has been from hostage negotiators and people like that understanding that, that they’re dealing with people that are really just ready to, to blow. And yet all the more reason all the more reason to respectfully address and help uncover what their real needs are, not what I think their real needs are. But what they think their real needs, what they consider to be the most important thing, how they feel in their terms, not just what that person seems to be to me from the other side of the table, or the phone or the wherever. So, as we get into this, this is this is going to be the one sheet and I tried to get it all into one one sheet. And so we’ll probably be able to go in more in depth over this at different times. And as you practice and get more adept with the certain with your with your own skills. It’ll become more clear each of these in more meaningful and so you’ll be able to come back to this one page and you’ll start to see different things. But so the preparation is essentially You have to have a goal. And it’s important for you to identify that goal. And I want you to be clear about it. And even no matter no matter what it is just simple and it should be able to be written down very simply and concisely. Now, goal setting for big issues or you know, your life, that’s a whole nother matter. And, you know, that’s, that’s another, you know, we could workshop, that kind of stuff. And that’s kind of fun to do, too. But here for negotiation, you just need to have a very simple, clear goal. So that, you know, when you reach your goal, context, you need to understand your context. And this is where your skills at summarizing and storytelling are going to become important, you do need to be able to any negotiation will take place in a certain context that doesn’t take place, you know, in your living room, necessarily, although some might take place in your living room. And that’s the context for that particular one. But each negotiation will have its own context. And its own little history leading up to that. And it’s important to remember, remember that and to be able to articulate it in just a couple of sentences. And to be able to remind those about that history, if there is it can be, it can be done very short, very quickly. But it’s one of the ways you connect with people, you connect them to the history, you’re able to articulate even just very, very quickly, some of the things that you value, etc. In laundry list, we’re going to prepare your laundry list, you dropped a list of your, the criticisms and complaints. And then you prepare little questions, you know, or statements. And sometimes it’s even good to practice them out loud. Because it can be hard to say those horrible things about yourself.

1:17:14
Without justifying them, and saying, Yeah, but I’m not really like that. And just simply saying, what they’re thinking.

1:17:31
We’ll get to, we’ll go into guiding questions, which are some of the ways this is some of the the work that’s done kind of, it’s helpful to do this ahead of time. Until you’re really good at it, he probably won’t think of it on the fly. But the the guiding questions are almost like, by by asking questions, or getting people to think in a particular direction, your questions, create the direction of movement of the dialogue. By asking guiding questions, you’re shaping that conversation. So what you need to think about in advance is one of the directions you want that conversation to go in what is important for you, and that comes back to your goals, understanding the context, understanding the negative things that they think so that then you can start with guide them in the direction the thinking the discussions in the direction, and then that that these come into play? Well, we’ll revisit this a number of times, but just I’ll just cover this at the moment the Curiosity labels a kind of the ways that then you turn some of those guiding questions into into statements that are questions. In other words, you’re making a statement, and we’ve already kind of used them as we talk about labels, but I’ll bring this to your attention. Now. When you say, it seems to me that you’re that you feel uncomfortable. That’s a statement. It seems to me that you’re feeling uncomfortable

1:19:39
to different ways of saying that to potentially different responses of the other person. When I make it as a pure state pure statement, with the inflection down at the end.

1:19:57
That’s kind of like truth telling. But when you make it a statement, because there’s no question in there, it seems to me that you, you, you feel uncomfortable about this?

1:20:15
Because there’s actually I wasn’t asking the question. I was making a statement. But when you say it seems to me that you’re feeling uncomfortable about this, and you end up with the inflection, I’ve turned that statement into a question. So it’s a no question question. Anyway, for whatever reason, it’s a very valuable thing to do. And so those curiosity labels that come that follow on from your guiding questions, so all of this is, as you gradually move through the labels, the mirrors have been having a person feel heard, and you’re constantly doing this all the way to continue to draw out additional information. I think you even noticed in earlier, earlier slide said that the labels, it’s good to have as a rule of thumb, about every fourth or fifth sync thing that you say, be a label. And then when you turn it into one of those statements, it’s it’s, it’s inviting additional commentary from them, it invites them to come up with something else that they might not have ever, they might not have ever said to anybody, maybe they might not even be clear about in their own thinking. And they definitely never said to you before. So then the curiosities labels and statements, curiosity, because you’re still actually asking questions, you’re still trying to, but it doesn’t have the same you’re not. I guess, behind this. And we’ll get into this next week, when we look at the no stop conversations about really understanding the value of No, we’re not actually going after a yes. And we mentioned last week that there are at least three kinds of yeses, but there are reasons not to simply just go try to get somebody to say yes, yes, yes. That we can discover more. by pursuing No. Then the last piece of preparation is to understand now this is more obvious, if you’re negotiating a deal, if you’re trying to buy a car, you know, if you’re, you know, buying a house, any of these big kind of financial things, there are also alternatives to cache and the dollar amount. And sometimes these can be extremely valuable. And sometimes what you can get as an alternative, on one hand can be more valuable to you. Alternatively, you might also, um, as you’re looking at, as you’re looking at, what are some of the cash alternatives in a negotiation, you can also be uncovering what is important to the other person, sometimes saving face is of the utmost importance to the other person. It’s not about the money at all, could be about their reputation. on financial issues, it could be, it could be not necessarily just about the total dollar amount, it could be about the timing of that dollar amount. Sometimes, you know, it’s like, Okay, if that’s the price, that’s the price. It’s just I can’t do it now. So you’ve got to find out well, you know, are there alternatives can you build in their timing issues? So all of this is just to say where we have to explore all of the elements involved in that. So why don’t I? I’m going to drop in right now. See if I can find it in the chat. Where did my chatbox go? chat box, come back. Okay. I’m going to drop this file in there if I can find it. Okay, I’m going to do it this way. Okay, so let’s go

1:25:17
you can open that on your computers at least and you can download it, print it out or whatever later on you can that gives you something to look at. So putting it very, very simply coming on to the the preparation for the for the goal you’ve got, it’s really important to be clear. So name match. I mean, even even on this one pager, I think you can see that, let me see if I’m going to stop sharing my mic, just share my

1:26:07
this one, so that we’re all looking at it together. So, right at the top, just write down negotiation time and date, I mean, this, this is probably for your bigger ones, but otherwise, otherwise, you can just use this at least as a guideline for, for thinking about things for identifying your laundry list for coming up with questions that you would be asking, etc, etc. But do identify the negotiation, the date and time and and give it a title. This is just part of the clarifying process. And then your goal, make it reasonable, make it a reasonable and have a stretch goal. What what would be really great to come out of this, but just be clear, have a goal, identify it, but write it down. Because Also, if you’re going into a negotiation, so even even Cynthia for your, for your interview, have your own goal, and have it written on a piece of paper and take it with you just be that specific, and have that as your goal. Ideally, you would perhaps if you’re if you’ve got a partner that you work with on this, tell them what the goal is, this is just this is just strengthening your commitment to your goal. Now, that doesn’t mean to say when you get into the negotiation that things can’t change, and you can’t adapt and all that, of course you can. But having that clarity is a critical place to begin. So identify it, write it down, take it with you. If you’re going somewhere, what’s it on your desk, if you’re on zoom. However it works. context, just write a couple of sentences and you might need more pages than than what you can, you know, get yourself out and have a piece of paper, that’s fine. But a couple of sentences that that pretty much just tell the story, remind yourself of where you’ve come and why you’re here with this particular person. And and even their think in terms of what are some of the positive things, you know, the values that they have. The reason you know as one of the reasons why you’re negotiating with them in the first place and not somebody else. And it could be just because they’re the only one to respond to you. But still, but still, there’s probably something more than just they’re the only one to respond to you. So identify it, remind yourself write it down preparation, preparation, preparation. So, even for the Patricks of the world, this is a good activity to do. Because then that will take you out of falling into your old habit of walking unprepared into a negotiation. Because when the when push comes to shove, we will we will rise or fall to the place for which we prepared. If we didn’t prepare very well, then we’ll we’ll be able to we’ll reach that point in our negotiation you prepare well. So then you you’ve got that to stand on. And that’s where your negotiation will begin. That’s where you that’s that’s your foundation for this. So preparation is really important. For, especially for really important conversations, some of them you’ll just find yourself in. But even doing this working on your one sheet for another negotiation, will actually help you in some ways prepare for any other negotiation because you’re already starting to build the muscles for, for preparing for your negotiation. Okay, so laundry list now if you’re really good, I way, way, way have not, you know, for some, some of our long standing relationships, the laundry list could be extremely long, but do make a point of thinking, what could they be saying about you? in their best moments, in their worst moments? Maybe they’re just echoing something they’ve heard somebody else say. But what is it, write it down, make a laundry list as long as you can about that particular instance. Now, if you if you if you’re going in there to negotiate in terms of your company or your business, then then you think in terms of what what their experience could be with you in the past, what their worries and concerns are, are about you. Now, thinkable all of those things,

1:31:34
because then you’re going to use them in that inoculation process.

1:31:41
And you can do that at the beginning of an email, you can start to say, You’re not gonna like what I’m doing what what I’m, I’m writing to you.

1:31:54
You can stop like that. He says, You can’t do your sewing. So you’re just not going to like what I’m about to say. That’s horrible.

1:32:10
You think I’m a flake, I didn’t get back to you in time, but I don’t care that I you know, whatever the laundry list is. You can say, you can add in there, you know, things like it seems like you want me to be. don’t justify it, don’t say that it’s right or wrong, just state what they could be thinking in their words. Don’t soften the blow. It’s gonna be horrible. You’re not gonna like it.

1:33:00
Make the list and think it through and practice writing some, some pieces out. guiding questions. So this is again, where where we are based on the goal based on and the process of uncovering, using our mirrors and labels, this, this process is going to be ongoing, it doesn’t just happen once it’s it’s not as simple as, you know, do this and it’s done, do this and it’s done, do this, well, setting the goal. setting your goal, it will be done and you take that into you with you, but how you work out and how you adjust the goal that’s going to be part of the process. So guiding questions. The purpose of them is to reveal relevant but not yet articulated. So ask, what are we trying to accomplish here? And that could be even a question Cynthia, you could ask. So you know, what, what, what are you to the grantors? You know, you could ask them, you know, what is it that you intend to? To get from this? What are you looking for in this interview? You know, it just helps me to understand what you’re what you’re hoping to get out of this? Because and cause you don’t say that the minute you walk in the door or something like that, but prepare some of the questions. What is the core issue? You may not be clear, are they looking? Are they concerned about how whether you’ve got enough experience? Are they concerned about the kind of outcomes that are possible? I’m most concerned about whether or not you’ve got your team in place. And all of your legal issues taken, I mean, I don’t know you don’t know. And, and different in different grand tours could be concerned about whether you’ve got all of your analytics in place to be able to properly assess your outcomes. Other people are more concerned about taking a risk on something that seems to have a great potential, you know, high risk, low reward, I mean, not high risk, high risk, high reward. But until you ask some questions, you won’t know what is most important to them. Once you understand that, then you can tailor your responses to that. But if you don’t know what’s most important to them, it’s really hard to there’s so many things you could tell them about your organization. And sometimes you can’t always trust the bigger the Ask the best questions. But you might not be fully aware of what’s really important to them, they might have stated goals, but the person in the room may actually be concerned about something else. So deal with the person in the room, try to have, you know, to draw out something. Another good question for you, Cynthia might be to say, you know, who else? You know how on? Even if, if you like what I have? Do you mean, who else is involved in the decision making? just it’s just information. They’ll either give it to you or not. But if you don’t ask a question, and then you can continue, you know, what, what, what do they see as some of the biggest challenges for organizations like mine? Then you can speak to their concerns and their fears? And something a question something like so, you know, what is the biggest challenge that you face? Or what are we up against here? And that’s kind of very generic, but in the context of the discussion, they will come up, they will be if they you know, if you ask them that question, they could say, well, yeah, you know, there are, there are two other organizations that are applying for the same thing. So you’re starting to draw out information. So. And it varies a lot with your circumstances. But again, the key thing, then, is for you to think through some of the questions that would be good for you to go in there with to ask to explore further about them.

1:38:01
And in this one, when you’re dealing with, for example, the situation where there are people probably not in the room to try to find out what is some of the other concerns of others who are not in the room. Because they are often the deal killers. The people who are not in the room, the people are the issues. And they could be either or. Because sometimes they’re deal killers persons. And sometimes they’re deal killing issues. And just to note, even if it is a deal killing person, you know, treat them as the killer, you treat them as the collaborator on the issue, you have to try to separate out the issue or the challenge from the person. But that’s we could dig into that and more another time. But so these guiding questions can become more more obviously important. In the case of your kinds of situation, and possibly even merely if you’d had this a little bit of a week earlier, you might have been able to use some of these things, to prepare yourself for conversations or to add into your emails back and forth or whatever, who knows. But again, it helps you begin to see the bigger picture of the negotiation, how you are uncovering information that will help you proceed through the process. So then, when then we come back to following up from these guiding questions. Then that helps you and these are some of the things that you could come back with again, Cynthia, it seems like finances are Important, it seems like teamwork is important. It seems like innovation is more important. It seems like whatever it is you whatever it is that you’re discovering. And then you use that to check because you’re not still not sure, you might have found out a little bit more information. But the key thing is to be constantly curious. Don’t assume, even with a little bit more information that you yet know all about the other, or the whole situation. So constantly, constantly be looking, be curious. And and use those. So it seems like that is important. And again, the inflection is at the end. You can also you can even ask them. So it seems like you feel that my businesses and my business is in a unique, unique position to do something.

1:40:55
Give them a chance to respond to that. That helps them buy into you. in an interesting way. Again, you can address worries and fears, it seems you’re worried that etc, etc. But again, these are not the absolute be all and end all questions here. And I’ll probably further tweak it. And as I get feedback, and as I move forward, a lot of this stuff keeps growing and evolving to thank you for being my beta guys. But a lot of this was getting getting onto you know, onto paper, my own stuff, and not just having it in my head but making it useful for you.

1:41:44
Because that’s

1:41:47
what is it that there’s another saying that students have goals, masters have systems to help people reach their goals. So with you having a system for your approaching your negotiation, you are well on the way to mastering your own capacity as a negotiator. And at the end the alternatives, you know, the alternatives to cash the alternative, think about what might be some of the other things that either that you can give that you think would sweeten the deal, or the or perhaps that you could ask on them that they might have that that is almost a throwaway for them. It might be somebody they know they could put you in contact with somebody, you can ask them if they would do that. But think it through, spend a moment preparing. Because these Once you’ve done this preparation, and you go through this just before you go on into your into your negotiation, then you have all of a sudden given yourself a whole heap of resources in that negotiation than you have otherwise ever had to draw on. Even if at the end of each say shoot, I forgot to ask that you probably asked 20 other questions or found out 25 more things than you ever would have in any previous discussion. So don’t blame yourself. So preparation preparation. So let me just quickly run through these again. On the slides that I had prepared that’s that’s a quick run through of the sheet itself. But I just wanted to run through some of the other play camps stuff I said too much stuff, I need to simplify things. But again, your goal be clear, be specific put $1 amount on it, we can remember being specific remember the certainty effect? I’ve mentioned it I’ll go over it again. We prefer precision, not approximates our brain can hold on to that more clearly. And, and set the bar high. You set the bar low. We you will you will for comfort reasons go to the low bar. That’s why I said do not. Do not do not come up with your best alternative to a negotiated agreement. That’s where your bar will be. That’s where you’ll negotiate yourself down to have an optimal goal. Have a big goal. Name the deal write it down give it a name that reflects your aspiration naming things is really good even naming labels. Fancy that naming emotion labeling emotions, when that’s what we’ve been doing all the time, accountability, discussion, call with a colleague or partner to, to help create some accountability for yourself, take your written goal into the negotiation with you. And again, notice what’s going on in your own head, are you already negotiating yourself down from optimal? Number two context, right a few sentences of known facts that have led up to negotiation. Because you what you what, what you want to be able to do here is to be able to relate to them and their mindset, you’re coming together. And and your history, your common history to this point, is, is good to remember, write down a couple of seconds, you want to have something to talk about beyond, beyond what you just want. And having a little bit of Common Ground your history together is a really good place to start. Keep it simple, you don’t have to spend hours on it. But again, to remember that be ready to respond immediately with your empathy skills to any of their arguments that they might have. You know, even historically, you know, the you maybe for some people that you know, you’ve had good moments, you’ve had bad moments, you’ve heard bad things about them, you’ve heard good things about them. Understand that and be clear, so that you can summarize and bring into that situation with you so that they remember why they’re here, why, what they really want what their bottom line, because you’re going to have to try to draw more out. But again, it’s creating common ground. So your your laundry list,

1:46:37
list them out, you know, you you know the person take the time to think about even the craziest things that they might say about you. Even the untrue things that they could say about you, they may use it generically on you could be an every woman thing, or an every man thing. Like nobody’s ever had those thoughts. You know, write those things, write those things down as well. And then roleplay it seems like, you know, it seems like you don’t you know, you don’t? It seems like you don’t think I’m fair, it seems like you’re reluctant to even listen to what I have to say whatever it might be roleplay saying out loud out loud, from their point of view, what I mean, you’ve got to say it, but from their point of view, what they’re thinking about you, it totally diffuses that negative emotion that can override the discussion, prepare your questions and labels, we went out that over the the sheet that’s to get under the surface, there are lots of information that they probably never told you before. As as noted, there are probably things they are unclear about which in the process of uncovering, you’re helping to clarify even for them. And that’s part of what can make the negotiation really constructive. understand whether you know what they’re trying to do? Are they trying to save face? Do they have a reputation? They have ego? Do they have control issues? Do they have existing promises? They’re all of these, these are factors that are going to be playing out in the negotiation, search, explore curiosity questions, it’s your I’m sure you’re starting to go to sleep now. Because this is all starting to be common stuff. You’re starting to see a pattern. Great. Next, I want you to start and use all of these things in actual questions, write them down, fill out your sheet and start to bring them into negotiations. Remember, every anytime you say I want something, I want to be the first in line, I want to get a grant, I want to buy a car. I want you to do such and such. I want you to go to bed now.

1:49:13
Negotiating negotiation.

1:49:18
I want you to hear me, I want you to hear my heart. It’s a negotiation, whatever. So again, even for all of these, think about the alternatives, what’s important to them, not just the the easily or the the surface thing catches the surface thing and lots of it, lots of situations. But even in relationships, sometimes it’s not just that the surface is not the only thing that’s at stake. So dig, look for alternatives in your conversation. So I’ve kind of gone over that and killed that one pager to death. Your homework for this week is going To be, I want you for at least one, at least one negotiation, big one, little one, I don’t care, I want you to complete the sheet. And then I want to hear from you next week. So maybe if you, you might have one that you don’t want to share publicly. So therefore your homework is going to be to do two sheets. One that’s really important for you that you don’t want everybody else to hear about. You know, that’s, that’s up to you. I mean, it’s completely up to you again, what happens in here is our private space. But I do want you to prepare at least one sheet that, that you can go over publicly. And I will invite each one of you to do that. And if you’ve got another one that’s really, really important to you, and you don’t want to share it, then you’ve got it homework, or at least two sheets. set of questions. Any questions about the sheet? You everybody could download it? I’ll make sure that it’s up on that. Yeah. Any thoughts and questions, reflections on what we’ve covered this week, we’ve got just a few minutes left, I always seem to talk to my, my apologies for talking your ears off.

1:51:50
I think the one thing that kind of came up for me is in anticipating either the laundry list or anticipating things. I mean, that I feel kind of a hesitation to assume things, even though we do all the times. But if I assume things about the other person, then I’m framing something in my own mind before it happens, which can then be a self fulfilling prophecy. So if I, if I’m, and I’m assuming a lot of things about how this person is thinking, but maybe they’re actually not, then I may actually be damaging the negotiation through those assumptions. And so it’s kind of for me, is it the challenge here of what you’re presenting is, is in especially in looking at the laundry list, or in and anticipating certain things that I think the other person may be thinking, it that always feels to me like a little bit dangerous, dangerous thing to go into. But

1:52:43
so then what I would suggest to you is to test it out, not in a high stakes situation. And it could be just with one of your kids. And it could be just not like they’re not high stakes. Of course they are but but you know, it’s just so a more common thing. I mean, just in a situation where it’s not a high stakes issue, you could still just try out. I don’t know, I guess you’ve always thought that your dad’s a bit of a, I don’t know what any of your kids say about you. If they ever had a thought about you, I mean, stick with the ones that you think that they actually have said.

1:53:24
Yeah, it’s interesting. I do have a fairly serious meeting this afternoon at 230. So I’m going to make the sheet for that. And yeah, and I’ll see, this is really good. It’s really good. I really so inspired by this. So

1:53:40
yeah, still even on that laundry list. And you can choose to use it or not use it and then might become there might come a moment in the discussions where you can see that there are some concerns that are really coming up and you you can hear, you know that there, there’s some hesitation. So you and that could be where, you know,

1:54:08
it sounds like you think that I’m just not going to be able to get this pulled together. Yeah, that me and my team just I mean, you could you don’t have to use the term flake unless you would think they would use that term. You know, I but I but but still endeavor to imagine what that person is concerned about. So again, the idea is not just to throw out anything that’s that’s actually false and unwarranted. But that that person in their situation looking at you, is likely to say even wildly, say and even if you then say something that they’ve never exactly thought, let’s that’s the objective here is to get them to say no Actually, what the laundry list is getting them to do is to say, No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. The purpose of that is to get them to say no. I mean, ideally, they don’t say, even if even that was a thought. They’re going to say, No, no, no, that’s not the real issue. They’re gonna, they’re going to take it somewhere else. Because they’re there in the negotiation, they do want something to work. And so then that is laid aside. And then they’ll take it forward. So the the purpose of the laundry list is actually and I didn’t get into the into it, because that’s next week, but you’ll see that all of these things do kind of circle back around that are all interconnected, but is aimed at getting them to say no. I wasn’t looking for a yes. In the laundry list. The objective was to get them to say, No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, that’s not what we’re doing here. No, no, no, no, the real issue that was now the the heart of the matter, what we’re dealing with here is that of that data that I’m not really worried about you not not performing, Patrick. But if you if that if you think that that that you know some element that you either can’t come up with the numbers, you can’t be something about what they’re I don’t know what you’re negotiating. But if there is that what you’re trying to do is in accumulate that fear of this allay that fear defuse that negative concern, that is probably clouding them from freely working with you in an in the negotiation, and being constructive in the negotiation. So the purposes of the that laundry list is to defuse negativity, so that you can get on with the real work. But it’s also showing that you use you You’re, you’re standing alongside them, you’re you’re being you’re standing with them on that you’re seeing from their point of view, their concerns and their their worries and their fears. And maybe even their frustrations with you. I don’t know, I don’t know. But still try it out, even with your kids sometime. Just see what it does. Test it out, see if it works for you. Always running when you finish doing all the run through,

1:57:29
I thought you know, with the kids. So I’ve got four wonderful sons. They’re all you know, 4050 years old, and armoring up when I want something from them. I ring up and say, You’re nagging mother here. And there’s a laugh. Cinema. So her nagging mother, but they know the moment I say that I’m asking something. Yep. And then we get when negotiate. I want this wardrobe shift. It’s too heavy. I can’t do it. It’s your back. All right, what’s the time there’s what’s shift? Are you going to come in a certain time so they can help? So it’s not too heavy? So you know, this is clarifying what we do. So having that negative thing? Yep. Then, you know, yep. And by now.

1:58:29
Sorry, sorry, Beverly, just merely you’re going? Not a problem. I hope that this has been useful. We’ll see you next week. Please do set up a time. This week. with everybody find a time hopefully, if any of the times on the scheduler don’t work. Email me back and we’ll work something else out. Okay. Anyway, fantastic, everyone. Bye. Bye. See you next week. Bye. Bye. Yeah, so your point Beverly is is Yeah, you do use it already. Yeah, that’s it. It’s a good one. Yeah. You inoculate people. I mean inoculations work. No. I think

1:59:19
having those some when they put the laundry list, yeah. Put that way. And, and preparing before talking or negotiating with some somebody and having those wanting them to say no or whatever. It’s good, or really good. Because this is again, this is your system. I’m a big system person, as you know. So this is a system that what you can work with this is generic and you can apply it to everything in your life or professional. And we’re just gonna get it down pat in our thinking process.

2:00:00
Yeah. And part of it then is just simply becoming more comfortable with doing it. And so again, that’s why I come back to the very, very simple mini maps of just doing those simple things, just doing those and finding more places where you can test it out and get comfortable with it. And exercise those muscles, mirrors, labels, you know, dealing with your laundry list. And silence. Giving people that space to allow something new to emerge within them within in the relationship.

2:00:39
You have to go to thank you so much, Karen, and everyone. And I will see everyone next week. Thanks, Beverly. Yeah. Oh, so what you got those flowers?

2:00:57
Yeah, I just got flowers. I like turned it. Like if I had my virtual background on it was so funny. I was like virtual background. Like you really can’t see them. That’s right. You can’t see you can’t see the flower. And I’m like, Oh. My husband said it was going to breakfast and he just thought Oh, wonderful. Happy birthday to me. All Cynthia, here this morning with you in more ways than one. Yeah, I have. Yeah. It’s been great. Yeah. Yeah, it’s been so helpful. And I’ve already printed my sheets. And I loved Yeah, like, I think it’s helpful to define, you know, like negotiation, and all all of these other ways, like interviews and job interviews and people at the airport. And, like, I had this really narrow viewpoint of like, negotiation, like, where I would be using it, but it’s so much more universal than that.

2:02:18
Oh, it’s everywhere. It’s not gonna be with you with the lady at the at the store. We can negotiate anywhere I start getting a lot of stuff.

2:02:34
Even if nothing else, you just discovering more and it’s just makes it makes things that perhaps will once a little scarier, not quite as scary and having a little system in place that as you begin to, you know, trust it and test it out then it can make things that were not so fun. Even more fun. Oh, yeah. I like that knowledge know how it goes tomorrow? Oh, absolutely. It’s a big deal. It’s a $25,000 interview. Oh, yeah. Fantastic. Anyway, yes. Anyway, way, you can make it this week Camilo. So I hope Yeah, I hope we was that useful for you to see about, you know, even the standing in line and different things that you can do giving you options for how to deal with that next time.

2:03:37
Oh, next time, I guess there are so many many possible potential next times and not even worried me. But yes, you have to start with something even though it’s awkward the beginning and then it will become

2:03:50
usual. Yeah. Well, you know that how many languages do you speak Camilo? x? Six. Yeah, so how many six times at least you’ve been awkward. First as a baby. Well, six languages wasn’t languages. I guess. Spanish English, Spanish,

2:04:08
French in your in the right order Spanish, French, Portuguese, English, Italian and German. Wow. Yeah. I like that. So I like that. But I I can’t negotiate. So that’s the problem.

2:04:25
You haven’t been great at negotiating yet? Yes. And already, you’re seeing a way forward. And thank you for that. Yeah. I’m more than delighted. More than delighted coming along. Anyway, so I look forward to seeing you all next week. And looking forward to hearing stories. I love it. Yeah.

2:04:55
Even though I’ve just forgot my sentence and say oh, you know, or A friend, whatever, just the practice.

2:05:03
Yeah, just to practice. Absolutely. Just to practice. Yep. See you later. Bye bye. Bye bye Hey

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